Video from the June 2009 Commissioners Meeting

Robert Thomas, of Campbell Thomas & Co., presented the Cresheim Trail, followed by questions and comments from the commissioners and the public. See below video for the official minutes of the discussion.

This video runs about 2 hours and 4 minutes. Click video to play.

Minutes of the June meeting pertaining to the trails discussion

Extracted from June 2009 Minutes

Mr. Harbison then introduced Robert Thomas, of Campbell Thomas & Co. Robert Thomas and James Innes, Chair of the Cresheim Trail committee, addressed those in attendance. Mr. Thomas noted that while the Cresheim Trail is not a County trail it is noted on the Montgomery County trail network map. Mr. Thomas provided a very brief overview of a variety of trails that are either complete or in some state of progress throughout Montgomery County. A more detailed review of the Cresheim Trail proposal was presented. Mr. Thomas traced the trail from Chestnut Hill below Germantown Avenue through Springfield, Cheltenham and back into Springfield. The trail principally follows an existing PECO right of way that one time was an abandoned railroad. Mr. Thomas noted that the trail committee has a license with PECO to install the trail within their property, however, to date it has not been executed by either party. Connection trails were also briefly discussed in the area of Arcadia University, Holy Sepulchre Cemetery and Erdenheim Farms. The Cresheim trail has been divided into four phases, with cost estimates for each. The phases are: Phase I, Wissahickon Creek to Bethlehem Pike, 1.8 miles, $537,000; Phase II, Arcadia University, .7 miles, $330,000; phase III, Bethlehem Pike to Paper Mill Road, 2.2 miles, $1.2 million; phase IV, Paper Mill Road to Stenton Avenue, 3.1 miles, $4.8 million. The feasibility study includes a lengthy list of County, State and Federal grants that may be available to help assist in the cost of construction. Mr. Thomas noted that Cheltenham Township expressed interest in the project in January 2009, however, made no commitment to assist in the funding of the project. Mr. Thomas suggested that the next major step would be to approach PA Department of Conservation and Natural Resources for significant funding of the trail, however, PA DCNR will require easements and rights of way in place in the segment of the trail for which funding is being requested.

Mr. Standish inquired why certain segments of the trail were designated as phase I or II. Mr. Thomas noted that these segments are connecting to existing trails and it may be easier to progress through the approval process.

Ms. Peirce inquired what fraction of the trail is within the PECO land. Mr. Thomas estimated that approximately 90% of the trail is within the PECO property.

Mr. Dailey asked how the committee would address the railroad land that has already reverted back to individual property owners in Flourtown, and inquired why those individual property owners were not specifically contacted for a meeting. Mr. Thomas acknowledged that not all the land had been acquired, but that he attended several meetings where the property owners to which Mr. Dailey was referring were specifically invited. Mr. Dailey asked whether they had met with the Springfield Township School District. Mr. Thomas indicated they had met with staff but not the School Board.

Mr. Harbison acknowledged that the Flourtown Gardens and a section adjacent to the route 309 and Willow Grove Avenue would be the most challenging sections of the trail.

Mr. Dailey inquired how the trail committee would address environmental concerns such as stormwater management. Mr. Thomas noted that the specific surface of the trail had not been identified, but that a combination of porous paving and regular paving can be considered.

Mr. Gillies opined that the trail committee seemed fairly committed to the design of the trail since it had not changed much since the initial discussion. While Mr. Thomas agreed for the most part, he did note that the trail was modified in the vicinity of the Harkins property at the 309 expressway and E. Willow Grove Avenue.

Mr. Harbison asked if the availability of the Lloyd estate would provide an alternate route beyond the Harkins property. Mr. Thomas said it was certainly something to be considered now that the property might be available.

Mr. Gillies asked how insurance requirements will be met for the trail. Mr. Thomas indicated that easement agreements will call out that the property owners are indemnified and held harmless. This insurance is normally provided by the Commonwealth, the County or local municipalities. Mr. Gillies suggested that the trail not be given any further consideration until issues in the vicinity of the Harkins property, Route 309 expressway at Willow Grove Avenue, the Flourtown Gardens, and the School District property are resolved.

Mike Harkins, 1799 Willow Grove Avenue, indicated that he is not an opponent of trails, but has been opposed to the Cresheim Trail proposal as the trail approaches his property. He suggested that this section of the trail is very costly to build and will not be pleasing to use. He asked that the committee consider alternates through the Lloyd estate.

Bernie Homer, 1704 Church Road, inquired as to the width, structure and purpose of the trail. Mr. Homer was told that the trail would be approximately 10 ft. in width, the structure was not determined but will run from crushed stone to asphalt, and the purpose of the trail is for recreational purposes.

Joseph Ruggieri, 201 Spruce Road, stated his opinion that regardless of the use of the trail, the trail is not wanted through the Flourtown Gardens.

Charlie Karl, of Pine Road, expressed his support of the trail and discussed the attractive nature of the area between Cheltenham Avenue and the route 309 expressway. He pledged his willingness to assist in any volunteer efforts in maintaining the trail.

Carolyn Kelly, Penn Oak Road, noted her opposition to the trail. She discussed the problems with a hard surface, litter, safety, liability, and lighting. Mr. Thomas reviewed possible solutions to the questions raised by Ms. Kelly.

Mr. Schaum remarked that it was his understanding that as of this date, the use of the railroad right of way adjacent to the Flourtown Country Club is not an option that has been agreed to by the Board of Commissioners.

Mike Lawrence, 1202 Malinda Road, inquired who funded the trail study and who might fund the project. Mr. Thomas indicated there were several sources that funded the study, and moving forward to the project, funds might be available through Montgomery County, the PA Department of Conservation and Natural Resources, and Federal transportation enhancement grants. Mr. Lawrence indicated that initially he was in favor of the trail, but as he has learned how various friends and families are adversely affected by the trail, he is no longer supporting same. Mr. Lawrence also suggested that one entity should be responsible for maintenance to be assured that it is done uniformly and correctly.

Dolores Shields, 404 Penn Oak Road, indicated that she participated in a small group to review the trail bed back in 2004 between Flourtown and Oreland, and it appears that the trail is significantly different today than it was then. Mr. Standish indicated he participated in that walk as well, and indeed it is a different trail.

Joan Anderson, 308 Penn Oak Road, indicated that she is not necessarily opposed to trails and has used trails through the area, however, she is not interested in a trail through the Flourtown Gardens.

Dan Moscovici, 1503 Church Road, stated that when he is interested in using a park, he needs to go outside of the Township. He believes that the trails would improve property values, are good for exercise, and will help connect communities.

Adina Birnbaum, 15 West Mill Road, suggested that her family has enjoyed the use of the abandoned right of way to the rear of her property. Now that the area has been improved as a trail, she feels her children can utilize the trail on their own. She has not had an issue with litter and is comforted by the use of the trail by the community.

Christine Kendler, of Philadelphia, offered herself as a resource as it relates to contact with State and regional equestrian groups.

George Benz, 8458 Trumbauer Drive, inquired how the Township will proceed with further consideration of the trail. Mr. Harbison suggested there were many options: (1) the Board could approve portions of the trail, (2) the Board could approve the trail with the exception of the difficult areas, and (3) the Board could approve the trail subject to conditions set forth by the Board of Commissioners.